Thanks,

Vikki

Dr. Bynum supplied me with your email address, and I will contact you with information on my family members and the picture that I have.

Thank you both!

Shelby

Like you, I was surprised to find my Mississippi genealogy was not as Solid South as I had supposed. It includes on the one hand a Piney Woods Confederate deserter and renegade named Jasper Collins. On the other there is a non-slave owner named Jesse Pack who fought in Robert E Lee’s Army of Northern Virginia through 15 major engagements, including the Peach Orchard at Gettysburg, yet survived to a ripe age. And for good measure, up turned gr-gr grandfather Llewellyn Maddocks, Union veteran from Maine who ended up married to the daughter of a slave-owning Confederate veteran in Perry County. By the way, Llewellyn’s father-in-law despised him until he discovered they shared a love of hunting, after which–as humans are wont to do–he decided he could make an exception for one yankee.

The Civil War was the pivotal event in American history, so we should attempt to develop some appreciation for the tremendous impact it had on the lives of our ancestors. I do not seek to venerate some while sweeping others under the rug because of the choices they made. My mission is to try, as much as humanly possible, to understand the forces that caused these individuals to make the difficult choices fate forced upon them. My scholarly friendship with Dr. Bynum is based on our shared efforts to learn about, rather than either mythologize or castigate, these people.

Dr. Bynum can supply you with my email. I will be very happy to add the names of your relatives to my research list of south Mississippi Union enlistees. If I can locate and obtain pension files for them, I’ll let you know. We need to learn more about these men, whose Union service was often obscured in the post war years.

Ed P.

Mr. Payne, I read that you are researching soldiers who went to New Orleans to fight for the Union. I have identified at least seven of my relatives who were in the 1st New Orleans Infantry, including my direct relative, Reutilus Hariel, who lived in the area where I currently do, the area where Pearl River, Hancock, and Harrison Counties all come together. After being told since the 4th grade that I had no direct relatives who fought, I was rather surprised to find his name on the roster of this unit just three years ago. Since then, I’ve been discovering more among my Bounds and Smith relatives. Richard Bounds, specifically, was wounded and later captured at Vicksburg before deserting and enlisting in the Union unit. I also have a picture of my Smith relatives which shows five brothers, two of whom fought in the 1st NO, one who fought in the 3rd MS and one in the 17th Battalion Cavalry. This is just one example of my relatives fighting against their kin.

Being a Southerner to my very soul, it’s been difficult to understand and accept. However, I do wish to learn more about them and have only been able to find a very brief history of the unit. Do you have a website or have written any books or articles where I could read more? I’d greatly appreciate any information.

Thank you for your time.

Regards,
Shelby Harriel
shar_14_22@yahoo.com

I think perhaps you are aiming your fire at the wrong target. There are several books on the Knight Band, all differing considerably in their point of view. Tom Knight’s book basically depicted the Knight Band in a Robin Hood manner, even though he personally despised his father. Ethel Knight’s “Echo of the Black Horn” paints a very negative portrait of Newt and the members of his band, making exceptions for the Collins men and a few others. While useful for their stories, neither is a work of history.

Rudy Leverett made the first solid effort to explore the historical truth behind the folk tales. His book, “Legend of the Free State of Jones” has recently been re-issued. It does not in any way extol Newt or his band. He seriously questioned the political motives ascribed to the band and felt the events had been much overblown for various political reasons.

Vikki’s book “Free State of Jones” goes into the complexities of how cultural heritage, socio-economics, and kinships shaped local events and attitudes before, during, and after the Civil War. She found clear evidence of Unionism within a core group of families such as the Collinses. Her book is based on heavily researched facts, not mythology.

Your intended target may be the recently published “State of Jones” which does paint a much more heroic picture of Newt Knight as a Piney Woods abolitionist. Both Dr. Bynum and I have published separate criticisms about what we feel are the liberties this book took with the historical record.

I am currently researching men who did exactly what you said they did not: leave the Piney Woods and enlist with the Union Army in New Orleans. Thus far, I have identified 46 such persons–one of whom, Riley J. Collins, was a brother of Jasper. Of these enlistees, 15 can be found on the Knight Band rosters. Many of the rest had close kinship connections with those on the rosters.

In stating all this, I should make one thing very clear: while I have another ancestor who fought with the Army of Virginia during the entire war (and lived to attend the 50th reunion at Gettysburg), I do not agree with anyone who tries to label the Confederate leadership as “Unionists.” That is a serious distortion of language. People cannot fight a bloody, protracted war seeking separation from the Union–whatever their individual motives–and be considered Unionists. And no one was clairvoyant enough to know what Lincoln was going to do with the Constitution when seven states passed proclamations of secession after his election but before his inauguration.

Like Vikki, I think we’ve all said our piece and need to move on. But I do hope you will read Rudy Leverett’s book and then even consider delving into what Dr. Bynum’s work. It might help improve your aim.

Ed P.

Of course Newt Knight was a deserter. No one on this blog has denied that. Many Unionists joined the Confederacy in hopes the war would be short, and sooner or later deserted.

Nor, by the way, has anyone on this blog argued that all the members of the Knight band were “brave patriots.” Some, perhaps many, simply did not want to die, and many became Unionists for personal rather than ideological reasons, as Ed has already pointed out. Again, it’s a complicated story, and one that I have discussed at length in two books.

I think this discussion has been exhausted. At a certain point it’s wise to simply agree to disagree and move on.

Vikki

Also my apologies to you for getting you and Vikki confused. it was unintentional and a mis-step on my part.

You are correct, records and men serving in the 7th Batt. and the 7th Infantry are constantly getting mixed and confused. The 6th Mississippi was first assigned as the 7th Infantry then the 7th Infantry was formed with men of southewest mississippi. This causes even more confusion.

Sir I am not arguing about the Collins family being Unionist as I pointed out Robert E. Lee was also a Unionist so was Jeff Davis and many men who fought and died honorably for the Confederacy. The war itself was about the union and the abuse of the Constitution by Lincoln.I fully understand the names and what you have pointed out, however these actions do not make Mr. Collins a military man or anything more or less than a deserter when he had ample chance to join the Union Army. I hate to say it but that is the historical facts in a nutshell.I can fully understand why his neighbors may have voted for him, he was most likely a man of his word and offered a change. Maybe he was just a good old boy?? The problems in Mississippi had nothing to do with the Confederacy, in fact the farmers themselves were partly to blame for low prices with over production of crops.

Your summary would ring true for a lot of families of Mississippi. I have letter my grandfather of the 7th Mississippi Infantry wrote telling about the the horror of losing Vicksburg. Most of those surrendered and paroled returned to the Confederate Army. The difference is these other Mississippians did not take up arms against their fellow Confedertates and do everything possible to avoid confortation with either side. One of my grandfathers deserted, came home and buried his wife and son then went back to war. Another grandfather lost his life at Chickamauga, two brothers at Oxford, one wounded at Jonesboro, Ga. and one wounded and captured at Anthonys Hill. These men deserve the title of soldiers and warriors and all the honors that go with with such a title. They didn’t run and hide anytime a military unit came around.

I have no doubt what so ever you grandfather was a unionist and I have no problem with that. I would have no problem with him being a Union soldier either. I do have a real problem with the with the idea of promoting the entire newt Knight band as a bunch of brave patriots fighting to save the Union when historical records do not bear out that fact.

Regards,
George Purvis

You responded to me, or at least I thought you were responding to me and I did likewise. I was mistaken in thinking that you were the owner of this article. My apologies.

There are been so much written about Knight and his band, it is hard to separate fact from fiction. In reality I cannot see how Knight can be anything more than a deserter. Unless I am mistaken he never once ventured outside of Jones county to attack a Confederate Unit. In a nutshell he was happy to stay in that area and live out the war and support the winner. Being that he had enlisted in the CSA army for what ever reason, that made him a deserter.

To be honest, I have no dog in the fight except that I disagree these men were anything but deserters for whatever reason they chose to leave the ranks iof the Confedeate army. To give them any credit as a military unit is a disgrace to the men who wore, fought for and died wearing the blue or gray.

I would expect anyone associated with Knight to give a sterling testament to his and their actions to try and get a Federal pension. That actually makes good sense to me. My interest is history related and to date I have not found the historical records that show Knight’s band as a partisan unit or any other type of military organized fighting force.

On another message baord we have discussed the historical accuarcy of the Newt Knight myth. Please go to this link and check out some of the comments. I think you would enjoy a civil historical exchange.

http://history-sites.com/cgi-bin/bbs53x/nvcwmb/webbbs_config.pl?read=63922

George Purvis